Sunday, February 01, 2009

Indian Express: Army says no to Brahmos missile

My colleague and friend Amitav Ranjan had this report in the Indian Express today: The recent failure of the 290-km-range Brahmos missile to hit a pre-defined target and the high over-run in its production cost has put a question mark over fresh orders for 240 of these missiles from the Indian Army. Click here to read the rest of this troubling report.

On another note, today the Indian Coast Guard completes 32 years of service to the nation. Best wishes.


Anonymous said...

And shiv,

Did ur friend made a detailed report and inquiry regarding how the test failed and stuff?

the answer is a BOLD NO.

these days its becoming sooooooooo common with these guys to come up with some news which is half cooked and etc etc.....But on the reality side...none of the sooooooo called reporters are doing their job correctly.May be they just want a report to fill the 2.5x2.5 section on the mazgine/news paper.But if they put some more effort and do some investigation to know wot actually happened behind the screens, these days we dont have to blame DRDO/ARMY/......

the actual failure is becos of a new guidance system which was developed in home especially for land attack version of Brahmos.And the guidance system worked fine during the in lab testing and procedures.But failed in the real test during the missiles final phase.And it is a missile which is travelling almost 3 times the speed of sound.And the test can be attested to be the most difficult and critical one to test a guidance system like this.Having N number of similar objects and marking one with red X ........think abt it and the situation during a 2.8 mach flight envelope.

I some times often wonder......if these a$$ holes do use their brain or not?

IF they would have put a little effort before bringing the situation infront of public....It would be worth a billion dollars.
But sadly on the other end INDIA as a nation dont have any reporters who work for the cause of the nation,rather who work for themself and for few extra bucks.

IF money is the only thing which makes these reporters to edit such crappy articles and reports in news papers and mazgines, there are a numerous number of ways to earn money.

I used to have a great and utmost respect regarding these defence reporters before.But not et all any more.they lost all this respect.ofcourse people may not care if i respect them or not,its a diff story.

but AS an INDIAN and being a journalist,one has to be patriotic in the first and next is to bring gud to national defence forces.

And how many of your friends and fellow reporters print the news of these political leaders scams and interference in defence deals and matters?

the only thing i understood is each and every journalist in india work for money but not for country.And they feel sooooo gud while working for those yankees.How many of them reported and dragged the news regarding the 6 naval sailors killed in USN Trenton incident?

Anonymous said...

isn't it the recent failures are from version 2 of the brahmos ??

Anonymous said...

Russians collaborated generously with us for the co-development of brahmos,which is nothing but an already abandoned old yakhont russian missile there must have been some catch to it! coz arms market is like that for us! Even after paying heavily through our nose ,we end up with shoddy stuff!
This is not the case with brahmos alone! DRDO should mend its ways! one side pakis are threatening to go in for war with us in any moment with their battle ready chinese made baburs and Raads ,DRDO is supplying half baked products to our armed forces!
DRDO is a shoddy organisation with out time bound limits for any of its projects and product development! Its a Banyan tree sheltering mostle many heavily paid scientwists, whose daily routine is to go around defence canteens for making purchases for their families and friends! Ofcourse! There are some dedicated souls too! but thats not enough! A missile can be claimed as a sucess ,if it exhibits 100% kill probability!So much for Defence Reduction and Destruction organization!

Anonymous said...

Oh man Shiv these DODO always comes up with new ingenious or is indigenous way of success

[*] The DRDO first claimed success.

[*] but had to backtrack when General Kapoor insisted on visiting the target site.

[*] found that the missile had overshot by a kilometer.

Then comes a carrom ball from pillai:

“The missile performance was absolutely normal till the last phase but the missile missed the target though it maintained direction,” Brahmos Aerospace Corporation Director Sivathanu Pillai admitted later

Now the Russian roulette, with DODO khichdi: Rs 8,500 crore (October 2008 prices) for arming two regiments compared to Rs 3,000 crore in 2006.

The DRDO says that the cost escalation is due to the new price of Rs 27 crore being asked by the Russians for each missile compared to Rs 13 crore earlier.

Rahul R said...

I cannot believe this. Just because one test has no achieved its objectives, the Army has decided to dump such a phenomenal weapon system. It is absolutely natural for some tests to not meet set test objectives since the missile is still under development.

Absolutely ridiculous!

Anonymous said...

what is it that the Army wants...what is the alternative?

Anonymous said...

anon @ 12:38

why should we pay for russians ?

i thought that the missile is developed indigenously here.

Prasun K Sengupta said...

The SCAN optronic multi-spectral sensor and its airborne data links are the very same as those used on the Popeye Lite PGM. This sensor and the data link are activated only in the terminal stage of the missile's flight and the activation ques are obtained from the ring laser gyro-based navigation system. Based on the Indian Express report claiming that the BrahMos overshot the target by a kilometre, it means that the PROBABLE cause of the failure was the delayed activation of the SCAN sensor caused by a faulty (or erroneously calibrated) RLG-based INS which was fabricated by HAL. It is a minor problem but the important thing is that the problem has now been zeroed upon, so the cure is very much within reach. The main problem, however, is the cost escalation factor and if things go on like this, then even the Mi-17V-5 contract will be jeapordised. I don't know how the Mi-17V-5 costs US$15 million per unit when in the case of Malaysia Rosoboronexport was last year asking for only US$12 million per unit. Maybe a special kind of Russian hyper-inflation of the type prevalent in Zimbabwe, perhaps.

Anonymous said...

@First Anon

Did ur friend made a detailed report and inquiry regarding how the test failed and stuff?

Report yes, see the info from both pillai and Army officials.

Inquiry.....are you stupid??

the guidance system worked fine during the in lab testing and procedures.But failed in the real test

Are you suggesting that weapons were meant to work in LAB environment but not in real test??

Having N number of similar objects and marking one with red X ........think abt it and the situation during a 2.8 mach flight envelope.

Was it not the objective of the test in first place?? or do you suspect the Army changed it midway on the the innocent "scientists".

I some times often wonder......if these a$$ holes do use their brain or not?

You are not helping yourself either, from the same opinion.

but AS an INDIAN and being a journalist,one has to be patriotic in the first and next is to bring gud to national defence forces.

Don't you think he showed his patriotism by exposing the hollowed success of DRDO?
or dud missile being inducted into defense force would have helped??

why am i force to think you as a ... leave it anyway.

And they feel sooooo gud while working for those yankees

where does yankees have a cut in this. Never mind you had to put it in, for whatever reason.

mirza said...

Idiot writer i can analyze and write much better way.

This are the line which foreign pick to malign India.

Referred as Indian post

Anonymous said...

@ Above anon A$$ Hole....

All tests are not meant to achieve objectives right away.

Each and every reply seems to be a reporter point of view rather than a citizen/techie point of view.

If you asshole design a engine for the first time and you want to test it ,U dont go to the testing ground by integrating it with the vehicle.U fist of all test the engine in ur lab and see the torque and RPM and compression ratios and wotever first and only if you feel comfortable and then only you go and integrate it to your vehicle and do a full testing about mileage and other parameters and like.
One needs common sense to know that even if we had/have to spend another few billions on just for research to chew suck the rationaile of those guidance and other weapon systems.......ITS STILL WORTH IT.

And You fcukers dont come and blame indian institutions as wasting the taxpayers money.

IF we are porkistan, then we may not need to develop such complex systems as china/NK will supply top of the shelf they have no matter what.

But we are indians.A technology denial was laid on us for decades.

This abt reality and you jingo fantasy.When there is no caompany in india manufacturing a car/motor cycle........Mrs.gandhi wanted to develop a main battle tank,a sam system,an anti tank missile,.......

And not to forget the space program.

After how many sucesses did ISRO finally launching its work horse PSLV and GSLV?

No one pin points that eh.... becos its is considered as civil organisation even though most of the technology is shared.

I do pay millions in tax ,but still i am pretty happy with wot DRDO or other research organizations have been up to only considering the available technology.

Wot abt the Trident missile dude?
after how many failures it succeeded?
Wot abt THAD?
Damn........during the initial tests its didnt even know where the target is.... and you assholes blame an organization who works for the country....

And one more mind blowing TID BIT is........

Any of these people in DRDO/ISRO/ any other research organization in India works for only for a few percent of the salary ,when their counter parts or juniors in US/France or any other nation were paid a lot higher than them.

If these few good people care about money instead of showing patriotism then today we India as a nation may not have any thing to say(prithvi,agni,akash,trishul,nag,dhanush,shourya,AAD,PAD,.....tejas,AJT,SARAS,...........PSLV,GSLV,.....)

we may be nothing without these few geniuses.
And today people like you blaming them running an organization is simply and only a half minded or ZERO minded person can do that.

After all its a single failure in a cluster of successes.Why do you reporters being so pessimistic?

People come up any talk about private sector and thier achievements......And how do this private R&D companies achieving that? by going all by themself?
NAH...By buying the small technologies from other institutions.
BARC itself has a multidimensional objective of developing as many technologies with in its reach for the civil and defence bodies.One you go and have a look at BARC webpage you can see the technolgies they are transfering to private sectors.

Anonymous said...

Brahmos to be inducted only after it proves capabilities: Army

New Delhi (PTI): With the BrahMos failing to meet the mark in last month's test, the Army on Sunday made it clear that the supersonic cruise missile would be inducted only after it proves its capabilities.

"Army would want DRDO to prove the capabilities of the missile before we move the proposal to the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) for purchasing of missiles from them," Army sources said here.

Anonymous said...

man, this idiot paki buradiah is spamming this board again. after 26/11 these scum still have the guts to post on indian sites. shiv please excise this sick bugger (this paki is the anon at 12:38 and 6:26 pm) from your blog. he can go back to throwing acid on women or shutting down schools or whatever it is that these pakistanis do.

Anonymous said...

The proof of the pudding is in the eating!!!! DRDO siphons off a sizeable amount of moolah from the defence budget to pay for these escapades and their scientists (?).

Anonymous said...

prasunji! There are no RLG based INS in Brahmos! Please verify facts !

Anonymous said...

@ anon @ 6:26pm
C'mon shiv, pls stop commenting as an anon..


@PRASUN - That each unit of Mi-17V-5 costs US$3 million is not due to "hyperinflation" (which I am sure u said in jest) - it will go to line the pockets of ppl in the Defense Ministry.

Anonymous said...

shiv, plz cut out this crap of you friend. and stupid sensationalist reporting to boot. where exactly does army say "brahmos rejected" ??

Anonymous said...

Anon at 9.41 pm, very well said and very correctly identified and recognised Shiv

Anonymous said...

Shiv, stop being an anti-russian ghoul.

Anonymous said...

Hi Shiv
Sometimes I m impressed with your journalistic adventurism and thank you for taking the other side of the view into your wisdom. Hope you are not going to close this blog in future.

Let me tell you what all you defence correspondents' jokers are writing and thinkng. Military is a hard subject and most of you are crime reporters who are covering this beat. Rajat Pandit, Vishal Thapar, and couple of them are basically crime reporters covering defence. Just you get into Pentagon re0port of why embedded journalists were pressed into war coverage in Iraq. Thus, it will give you a fair idea everything progresses in stages whether it is Brahmos equipment or LCA platform. Whatever India is today it is due to this scientists whom you condemn as sh..

If you won't have Agni, Prithvi, Akash, Brahmos, and many and your space programme nobody would have offered you this Indo-US nuclear deal or any such equivalent.
I am an exposed person and had interacted with op scientists of NASA , Italian space agency, Russian space agency, pentagon and Los Alamos scientists in various occasions and take their feedback about Indian scientists working in DRDO or DPSUs. Let me tell you they all salute them with folded hands. But Indian scientists or their failed achievements in terms of LCA , Brahmos, Akash s due to lack of exposure and technology barrier that was imposed on India for 4 decades. But their physics and mathematics are not weak. If it happens then you will not be safe in your headlines today AC Cabin. So first you and your so called esteemed colleagues must learn and develop ability to analyze then opt for dissemination.

It appears couple of jokers including you are now creating a platform for lobbying for companies like Boeing.

Let me tell you something about Boeing for which you run a campaign. This company is known for hobnobbing with political power of a particular country and extract defence deals. So be careful, you may be caught tomorrow while excepting bribe.

Anonymous said...

lets face it no country has a defenses firms has perfect but if so third world country firm make any achievement even after western denial .They get mad and start make small failure a big issues by pay few dollar to third world press .That why Chinese don't have any independent press and U.S. get more mad and deploy there F-22 in Japanese bases.DRDO is good firm it and it put all affect in its project but as in world firm there some success and some failure and project go on like us nuclear powdered super carrier ,soviet/Russian nuclear submarine,french delta-wings aircraft that were first called tailless flying dumb but proved them when need and all critics shut their mouth same cases with us and Russian but here we Indian don't thing that we can make it and don't show confidences in DRDO leads them to do nothing rather then criticized by headless Indians .They have closed Arjun project,IGMDP,thinging of closing lca project and defiance ministry and army is try to cover up whole that not all now drdo has start rejecting new project as case with future tank,MCA,UCAV and many more but army trys to cover by that we encouraging private sector but God know only they will do when best firm in India cannot do much with villagers.They(best scientists) have start getting out of DRDO .at last ,indian villager so called army start respecting these people before they are gone .These people donot only provide the world but better by their new invention but the so first world gets mad by seen.likeIn May 2008 Indian scientists announced they had developed a patented path-breaking technology will increase the range of missiles and satellite launch vehicles by at least 40%. The enhanced range is made possible by adding a special-purpose coating of chromium based material to the blunt nose cone of missiles and launch vehicles. The material acts as a reactive-ablative coating that forms a thin low density gaseous layer over the tip of the rocket or missiles as they approach hypersonic speeds; this super-heated gas layer reduces drag by 47%, thereby allowing range enhancements at least 40% and later there was attack IIS scientist in Bangalore financed by US and trained by porkistanis .

bull said...

i think this is bullshit written by some day dreamer

Anonymous said...

Nothing from today's Aero-India presser?

Prasun K Sengupta said...

To Anon@9:30PM: FYI there are two types of ring laser gyro-based INS used for BrahMos. One is on the land-based MAL and the other one is on board the missile itself. That same RLG-INS is now being retrofitted on to the Prithvi SS-150 launchers/missiles and on the Pinaka MBRL launch vehicle. These developments were extensively written upon and photographed and reproduced at the DEFEXPO'08 show dailies published last February. The RLG-INS is being series-produced by HAL's Avionics Division. Kindly contact BrahMos Aerospace, Bharat Dynamics and HAL to get the clinching evidence, lest you choose to disbelieve me.

left wing nut job said...

and start being a pro-Russian jackass!

Tejaswy said...

BrahMos failed as US shut its eyes in the sky?

DRDO scientists have launched an investigation into the failure of the BrahMos army version missile, especially why its GPS system couldn’t link onboard computers with hovering satellites eventually crippling its guidance system and keeping it from achieving mission

Huh..That kinda explains





Anonymous said...

prasun! i belong to one of those orgs which you have stated! No RLGs please! 1001% sure, verify again!

Anonymous said...

Prasun Sengupta,
It is hard to believe anything you say, for obvious reasons. What ever you've been saying all these years doesn't come true.
More over your brand of journalism smacks of unreasonably favouring certain parties, even when the obvious presents itself, which makes everyone wonder if stories of Lifafa journalism are true in your case.

Anonymous said...

brahmos and prithvi r even cheaper than some european and US air to ground atrtack munitions and packs much better punch

so what else can b cheaper than this